Well, I’ve decided that my participation in the Todd Bentley saga is over, as far posting any more personally written articles, & commentary on my blog. I had made the decision some time back, however, after this recent news of Bentley was released, I decided to post up a few things related to the matter. I am saddened over this whole thing. I do and have prayed for Todd and his family. God knows that I have feet of clay.
My belief is that it is now incumbent upon those men and women, especially Leaders, within the renewal movement to begin to speak out about these things and clean it up yourselves. For some of you, it may mean having to make a clean break, especially in light of the fact that it appears that from most of the top tier Leaders, it’s going to be business as usual. If they do begin to speak up, I will post their statements up as a broader range of interest.
It does the movement no good when men like Bill Johnson identifies folks who have been sounding the alarm since the beginning of this Lakeland movement as, “Accusers, sharks, shooters, religious, rigid, political, throwing out the baby and operating in a denominationalistic spirit.”
It may help to save their own public image and calcify their own agenda and base. However, as someone looking from the outside in, it really only serves to reinforce the perspective that many of us have that these men are elitist, arrogant snobs. So, Bill, knock it off and just show some humility and grace. An “I’m sorry” would go a long ways.
It appears as though the core foundational belief structure and world view of men like Joyner, Johnson, Ahn, Wagner, et al, is so entrenched, I don’t know that anything in the short term can be done to rectify the situation. They have all clearly demonstrated that they are more interested in saving face and covering their own hind ends, which is sad. That’s exactly how I have taken every single statement from these men since Bentley announced through his Board that he’s stepping down. Here’s continued proof of that reality.
So, with that I’d like to recommend two sites that do an excellent job reporting on items related specifically to Bentley, I’m sure most have already accessed these sites anyway. These two have the most exhaustive coverage of these things as anyone on the net. Here are the links:
http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/
http://pjmiller.wordpress.com/
The Phoenix Preacher has written some great observations as well. In addition, that site probably has the most active reader participation on the subject.
Feel free to check in from time to time as I will try and address items that are broader in nature and not specifically focused on the recent Todd sightings 
Scott
Scott,
Thank you for posting these things here and at PP. You have done a great service for the body of Christ. We can thank God for the victories we have seen achieved and pray for more. Bless you bro,
JimB
Scott,
Thanks for all you’ve done to help protect the body of Christ. Your love for Christ and his people is evident. Your service has been appreciated.
Dan-o
Scott,
On behalf of our congregation, we want to thank you for presenting the evidence we needed to be discerning. It kept the impact of the Lakeland distraction and deception at a minimum.
Your phone call to me (after years of no contact) was an answer to prayer! Thank you for following that prompting in your heart.
As we all move on I believe God will use this for the good of those who love him and are called according to his purpose for them.
Good job Scott. It has been very helpful to read your posts.
Just an observation, if I may…and one that some folks may not appreciate being stated, however…
There have been many problems within the CC movement, which have been discussed openly in the blogosphere. Within this group of readers, and from parallel blogs that many of us frequent, there was strong expectation that the CC problems be discussed publicly among those in the CC camp, with an openness that allowed others to check the progress and challenge the thought processes.
That same expectation towards the TB/Renewal Ministries camp hasn’t existed among this group of readers from your blog and others that cross pollinate. No one has been outraged that we cannot view the “in house” discussions from that camp, and no has has cried “foul”, or said, “what are they trying to hide”, “why can’t we know what they are doing about it”?
Perhaps it is simply a matter of “that’s how things worked out”, or perhaps that expectation hasn’t been present because not many of said readers have been part of the TB camp. That former expectation probably existed because many of this group of readers have been from CC. Perhaps that is why that expectation existed, but doesn’t exist from any in the TB camp. They haven’t been a part of these blogs. so there is no expectation to respond directly.
All that might sound like sour grapes, but it’s not. One blog went private so that CC issues could be discussed “amongst the famly”. I hope the same discussions are being had among the TB camp and others in his extended family. I don’t need to know what their private discussions are, until they come forth with some kind of public statement. Until then, may God lead their closed door discussions.
I will give credit to Lee Grady however, who did something that no one in any CC camp did. Some say he spoke too late. At least he spoke. My associates could/should learn from that. The silence from my family has been deafening at times. They are still my family that I love, but sometimes disagree with. Heck, I disagree with my self half the time.
I know for a few readers here and at other bolgs, this has been deeply distressing, and I am sorry for their pain. I pray that their leaders, and our CC leaders, will take these public problems and take notice, and do all they can to police themselves.
May history NOT continue to repeat itself on these issues, among TB’s camp, among CC, etc.
Blessings…
Bill Walden…relevant observations, I think. My prayer is that the Bride of Christ take seriously the marriage and it’s holy calling.
Scott.
You may be moving on from this specific fight, but your calling as a herald of God and paladin of His beloved has just been inaugurated.
What an initiation!
Take some time for fortification and renewal.
God bless you, friend.
~N
So Bill,
You cry foul because there has not been enough specific ranting against renewal? I am rolling on the floor laughing.
First of all the actual Bentley scandal is less than a week old. Second, there is so much information on the blogosphere the people have not had time to digest it. I get new public statements from Wagner, Johnson, Ahn, and the like hourly.
Finally, go back and read what has been written by myself and others REPEATEDLY… THE ENDORSEMENT WAS PUBLIC LET THE RESOLUTION BE JUST AS PUBLIC….there have been cries by myself and others to televise it and on and on.
Let your sour grapes become wine…it is more fun.
Still it is good to see you out and about lately.
So you and I will now say it together…LET everything come out into the light….everything.
Dread,
You misunderstood me.
I was simply trying to compare the circles we frequent and the responses that have been, and might have been.
CC guys visit PP, smp, nwm, FTA. We (CC guys) have been a part of those communities.
When the CC problems hit, these blog communities wanted us to keep public on these same forums. You remember that I suggested that family business stay private, especially for the sake of the lambs. Some, including yourself, were outraged that the CC camp closed ranks to talk privately. You then graciously let it be.
You are probably one of the few from your camp that visit the aforementioned sites. If there were more “renewal guys” on these blogs, would the cry for public discussion for the renewal camp be present? Would there would be a cry for you and you colleagues to discuss this openly, with the peanut gallery watching and chiming in.
I would again disagree with that expectation, and would seek to defend your needs for family to take care of family matters until such a time that the family makes a statement.
I am not calling for more public problem solving from Johnson, and his colleagues. That should stay private until a solution is found. I am for keeping family business in the family until a public statement is appropriately and deservedly given to the public.
My point was, that many in these blog communities cried foul when we CC guys wanted to deal with family problems privately.
If there were more renewal guys on these blog sites, would there be the same expectation for you and co. to talk publicly? I would hope the expectation would be the same, though I would still disagree with it.
Good to see you out and about too.
Hey Walden,
Excuse my ignorance, but what is nmw and fta?
Or do I even want to know?
Oh, I guess NWM is this site! LOL! Still don’t know what FTA is…?
Reuben,
FTA is the blog, “From the Ashes.” Check it out! Blessings.
Geez Dread you would think you’d be ALOT more humble. Given the fact that you were proven COMPLETELY wrong about this whole event.
Please, let’s don’t turn this into a slug fest. Dread by his own admission is a part of the renewal movement, and has been one of those most open to these things of anyone I have seen to date. He’s struggling and processing these events. Let’s give him space.
Reuben,
I meant nwm for this blog you are reading.
Another blog which is called From The ashes, which sprung out of Phoenix Preacher.
I agree on giving lots of room for Brother Dread. He and I are friends, and we be O.K.
He knows I am for him and not against him. He is a good man, and a man of integrity who is willing to get his hands dirty to make things right. We need more Dreads.
Praying with you BD.
Scott,
Thanks for all the updated info, on this mess, you have not only shared here, but were kind enough to stop by and share at Sola and other blogs as well.
I still believe the link to the radio interview you posted some time back, contained the most eye-opening information I’ve yet to come across on Bentley and what makes him tick…I really thank you for pointing me to it.
God bless
pj
As a point of perspective, it is often harder to change a movement from within than from without. Enduring the scorn of those from within and without, as Dread has done, is more than difficult and is spiritually, emotionally, physically and intellectually draining. I agree that he deserves our support and our prayers/
Thanks Scott,
The information you have provided has been valuable We have been sharing it with the leadership at our chuch.
I agree it is time for us to move on. I appreciate your sensitivity.
Phil
DreadHasNoDiscernmentEither
Whoever you are…
If you go way back into the archives at PP you will find several things…
1. Long before Lakeland I disavowed Bentley as a problem and noted that I had encountered problems with him.
2. I believe the record will show that I am the one who brought the Florida Outpouring to the attention of the blog to begin with.
3. I did give a provisional endorsement to the outpouring as being a work of God beyond Todd Bentley. The Lord is not hindered by one silly servant.
4. When I heard of the outpouring I sent two emissaries to tell me what was going on…They returned with less than glowing reports.
5. I have defended Bill Johnson, Randy Clark and a few others very strongly. I still stand with those men though I do not completely agree with them.
6. You are COMPLETELY wrong about my assessment. I never defended Bentley or his antics. I criticized the sudden laying on of hands on Bentley.
Finally, I was and am a part of the renewal movement. I have not left. Nor am I near to doing so. I have never drawn back from open discussion of the whole matter.
So now, what is the problem? You are offended because I call for OPEN resolution and for those who laid hands on Todd to account for themselves?
As far as needing to be more humble about things…you have a point. That is without question true. Now that is about all the humility I can muster right now.
Peace to you.
Bill,
Clarification accepted… I think we understand one another now.
I am quite happy to let Todd have his personal privacy but the scandal of Lakeland was the sudden public endorsement and the carelessness of the apostles. They should speak as publicly now as they did then.
So far their public pronouncements have been to;
1. Express care of Bentley and family…. (well done)
2. Defend the revival…(useless the fruit will tell)
3. Defend themselves as not knowing… (but they told us they did and that we should trust them then)
4. Demonize critics… (irresponsible, blame shifting)
5. Ask for time… (reasonable and acceptable)
The public Alignment and Commissioning Ceremony of Todd Bentley was intended to endorse Todd and quell critics. It was intended to tell us all that Todd was a man of God and the outpouring was real. My point is not that these things have to be resolved in an open forum…My point is that these men and women should address their own failure to exercise diligence. If Todd was under a storm of controversy perhaps they should have done an investigation. They did not, now they all tell us that ‘I thought these things (marital problems) were resolved.’ Turns out the critics smelled a problem…nobody listened.
What should be public is not the resolution of Todd’s problems…that will not heal him. What should be public is the confession of careless leadership.
I should join Scott and shut up now.
Dread, I’m shutting up because your voice and others like yours needs to be heard now.
There is enough proof now to prove Todd guilty a thousand times over. However, no real change will be brought to bear foundationally because of anything I say.
So, speak on. People are listening, critics and supporters alike.
Dread,
Well said. I pray your colleagues hear your voice. You are a credit to them. Many here are standing with you.
Implicit in the Bentley controversy is the idea that the endorsers of Bentley have a person stake in the matter.
That is to say that to endorse a man as being from God and then to gain evidence to the contrary casts shadows of doubt upon the endorser. His/her wisdom, discernment, judgment and credibility is called into question.
Many of the people endorsing Todd had private concerns and doubts that they did not and dared not share. To do so is to lose standing with your peers. Or those things were laid aside under the guise of Todd being something of a character.
On the other hand there were and are many who had genuine doubts about Todd for significant reasons. I do not mean evangelicals who hate pentecostal excesses and stereotype the whole crowd. I mean people of the camp of the Spirit-filled stream who saw in Todd character flaws that are dangerous. These primarily have to do with an inflated ego that was on parade regularly. Evangelicals would clip the wings of such a brazen personality. But in the charismatic/pentecostal stream those kind are relished. The larger the personality the greater the impact.
Here is my point. Many cool headed thinkers could have brought balance to the party and correction to Todd. Many saw early on that sooner or later this rocket would crash and burn. But their voices and gifts were not welcomed at the party. To say NO in these circles is to quench the Spirit or to ‘touch God’s anointed.’
The whole thing could have turned out differently if the Apostles would have actually listened to other gifted voices. We need one another more. And frankly Todd’s meltdown could have been private had these other voices been heard.
This thing can bring correction to the ‘river’ but …
What has happened re Todd Bentley has left us shocked and very let down. Sadly, I doubt if I’ll ever trust a ‘healing evangelist’ again. It’s a disgrace. I could see that all was not well with him. he was clearly burning out and struggling. Why couldn’t pastors see that? It’s been a disaster. A lot of people, GODTV in particular, have egg on their faces.
It seems that we have not heard the full story about his moral failings. This is the man who spoke to Jesus and went to Heaven. dear God! Who, just who, are we to believe and trust? This has shattered many Christians. And this is not a demonic note. It expresses my human concern.
Daphne, I am with you. Before Todd Bentley came along, I always depended on Jesus to heal me and I have been perfectly healthy at 62 on no meds. Now, I do have a toe that hurts from time to time and have been told that I am starting to get cataracts – well those weren’t healed when Todd called them out although I believed he was anointed and I would be healed. So now, I am going back to Jesus and skipping the healers. I do still believe that some have the healing anointing but I think I am getting along fine without them. It is a lot to try to discern who is and who is not real so I will jsut avoid them all. Don’t get me started on the false prophets in this whole mess!